The Wisdom Project

Sandra, age 77

What are the top 1-3 things you would like to pass on to others? How did you learn this?

I reflected on this a little bit and even though I’m probably as self-motivated as you could possibly be, I  still think there’s this special edge for working for something that you have personal passion about or that you have so much respect for the person above you that there’s this additional edge that you get from that. I’ve been in both situations where I had so much admiration for say the president of my bank that I just would have done anything to help promote his vision and agenda and ultimately I embraced it too. Then I’ve been in other situations where I almost had to shut off my surroundings and just totally be self-motivated to do my job to the ultimate. If I did not have that above me, I don’t know if you could tell a big difference in the outcome, but I felt it very strongly. It’s really interesting to look back on the things you’ve done, and I guess the ultimate is to be in a situation where you personally are passionate about something and the people around you, above you and below you embrace that same passion.

I think it’s really difficult to do this I think when you are running through jobs. But I think, for me maybe, since I don’t have children, in the last 20 years of my career, I kept thinking about what do I want to do to leave a legacy for the next generation. That’s sort of, in some ways, a replacement for not having children, who you’ve raised well and who are the next generation. So I was really fortunate to get engaged in two different things that have developed into that.

One was starting with the mayor and a very small group of people, the Greenways Program for Nashville, that is now 25 years old. It was a file in my desk, 25 years ago, the mayor’s vision. I immediately thought this is like manna from heaven for me because I think it such a wonderful thing. I’ve watched it grow now to over 100 miles of greenway in our county from zero. I’m still on the Board and I think it’s amazing when I think of all the people who have joined hands to make that happen. So many of them are still engaged from that early time which means they’ve continued that passion throughout the 25 years. In fact, I know very few people who were involved in the beginning that are not still involved and are very engaged.

The other one is involved in starting the city’s public art program from nothing. There were people who for years had talked about wanting to do that but there was so much grind it out time, it was almost like going back to graduate school and then passing legislation at the state level – things that were just not fun at all that were going to take a long, long time. There began to be a lot of people in the business community who were taking trips through the Chamber and seeing what a public art program could do for a city that just enlivened the space, created conversation among the people and just uplifting and really made you stop and think, ‘what do I really think of this’ and if you don’t like it, you could still have a great conversation about it.

Once I heard that the business community was really interested in it, then I moved it from the Mayor’s office to the Arts Commission and started the pick and shovel work to get it established. It was really grinded out and there were days I thought, there is no way this is gonna work. I felt like I was trying to do an entrepreneurial thing inside a government and it was like trying to turn a whale around in a bathtub. You thought it just can’t be done.

It was really tough and to keep your entrepreneurial energy up when you were going through this bureaucratic tunnel was a difficult thing. I had to talk out loud to myself on certain days – it’s going to get better; just keep moving, doing something to make it happen. Ultimately it did. But it took about four or five years before you actually had artwork on the ground that people could see and know that it was happening.

It’s continuing now and we probably have probably close to 100 artworks, all the way from bike racks to the big, red abstract piece that you see when you go down Broadway. I love that piece and it was so controversial in the beginning – there was more negative feedback than positive in the beginning because it was abstract. You know, anytime that you would say, ‘we are trying to start a public art program,’ someone would say, ‘you mean, it’s like those men with guns up on Capital Hill?’ Those statues? Well, not exactly.

The very idea to put this big, red, in-your-face abstract sculpture in Nashville, a very traditional environment, was almost more than some people could stand. Now I think it’s really embraced. I see it used as a logo, at time even on the nightly news; it’s interesting to see that it pops up everywhere. It does make an interesting backdrop and has sort of become a signature for the city.

It’s really funny that it was a wonderful open process for doing that and it was narrowed down to seven people who had international reputations. Then we had a big panel of people from here and one or two from out of town to choose the one we thought should go there.

We chose Alice Aycock, who is a New York-based artist who had been doing public art all over the world actually for 35 years. She’s no bigger than I am, 5’2” and she could curse like a sailor and order those iron workers around. It was wonderful. She was so sassy and feisty. A year or two after she had installed that piece, she called me one day and said, “I need to tell you something. That is my favorite piece of my entire life. I just love the way it’s sited; I love everything about it.” It was chosen as one of the top 50 pieces of public art in the United States. It’s really a great thing. You can count on all the fingers of your two hands how many people know that.

If somebody says to me they wouldn’t have any idea that I’d ever have anything to do with it would say, ‘I just don’t like that thing – it looks like a roller coaster.’ I would say, ‘Really? Tell me why you don’t like it.’ It creates a great conversation no matter what your opinion is about it.

It’s called ‘The Ghost Ballet for the East Bank Machine Works,’ and it’s supposed to pay homage to the old working river where all the barges were launched and that sort of thing. It’s called the Ghost Ballet because at every angle, it looks like a different position, like ballet positions. As you move around it, it does look totally different. I’m so thrilled that she was chosen and that she likes it so much. Makes me feel even better about it.

One of the early pieces we did is at the courthouse. There are pair of images that are glass – just the torso and head of a person on a stainless steel, mesh rack. It’s probably 30 feet tall. There are two of them facing each other. You can crank them by turning this outstretched arm. You can change the lights to different colors. I think for Titan’s games they turn it blue and so forth.

The artist, Thomas Sayer, who did that is from Raleigh, NC. He’s a nationally if not internationally known artist. He was inspired to do that work because of the film, “Eyes on the Prize.” I’ve thought about it so much since we had what started out as a peaceful protest and then then a pretty destructive one later. There’s been so much segregationist and integrationist history at that site, and West was the one that young students from Fisk talked to on those steps to have the Fifth Avenue dime store lunch counters integrated and John Lewis, of course, was involved in that. So, in a way I have felt like those pieces, they are called Citizens, that in some ways it means even more than it did when it was installed. Because it continues to be a forum for citizens to participate in good ways and bad. It’s really interesting how those things evolve and you never know where they are going to be placed for a good reason or not so good reason. But I like that they are there and that’s what they were inspired by.

I think being a citizen of your own place is really important. I think that no matter where you live, I think that being engaged and trying to come up with a way to contribute, whether doing something for your next-door neighbor or somebody you don’t even know is really important. I think as you go along, that becomes more important. I think we all get it some degree as we walk through life.

But I think now, more than ever, what do I want to do today that might make me feel more engaged in my community that would be a good thing to do. Maybe the person you might engage with would be totally surprised by it.

Just today, as a matter of fact, I found out that one of my neighbors who is retired and turning 85, I slipped a card into her mailbox. You know, she can’t go anywhere and we are all sort of like inmates at this particular point, at least giving her a card would let her know that there are people who do know it’s my birthday. She’s one of those people who has always been so involved in the community and now she doesn’t have that. It probably lifted my heart more than it did hers.

What wisdom can you share from your observations and experiences of the world in your lifetime so far?

I remember my first job I had a real fear of leaving it. It’s really hard to leave a job you really like but you fee like, after a certain numbers, and started out being a challenging job, you almost start to think, ‘I could do this job with my eyes closed.’ It was really difficult for me to start thinking about changing jobs. I was with the Bell system, where people did stay for their entire career. I kept thinking, ‘am I crazy thinking about leaving this job?’ So it took me a year or two longer than it should have to come to the decision where yes, I do want to get into something smaller so that I can be more entrepreneurial about what I do everyday.

I learned there was a new bank starting in Nashville and I thought, you know, that could really be interesting. I could use some of what I learned here in this big corporate structure in a new situation. I finally brought myself to go and check it out. The more I thought about, the more I thought, this is worth making the leap. I think my wisdom about it is not to be so afraid of change and it’s fine if you have several different jobs and careers. In fact, it enhances your life. Even if you like the job you have, if it’s not stretching you, you should probably be looking around for something that would.

I didn’t want to be a job hopper who was doing something different every year. But I do think really digging in and doing everything you can at your job but this is as far as I can go, I’ve done everything I can do here, you really do need to push yourself. Even if you’re very comfortable in that job, you do need to look beyond that and think, what can I do that would be exciting now? It’s not easy thing to do when you have a comfortable salary and you like the people you work with, it’s kind of like diving off the high diving board the first time. You think, do I really want to do this? And the answer is yes, absolutely, yes.

Each job I’ve had I felt was closer to who I was. I would encourage people to do that. If you’ve been successful in one job, you can be at least as successful in the next one.

Someone this week said to me that people in my age group are true children of WWII, that we had the saving mentality. This friend said, “Sandra, let me ask you something just to solidify my thinking you are also a child of WWI. When you get a little piece of soap down to the tiniest sliver, do you try to stick it on to the next bar of soap? Do you save it somehow? “What do you do with it?”

“Oh” I said, “I would never throw it away; I always stick it onto the new bar of soap.” She just howled – you are child of WWII.

I think I’m very generous of giving something but very saving of material things, almost to the point I have to talk to myself to throw things away. I could be a hoarder if I didn’t discipline myself.

I think there are these watershed moments that we all have that are just indelible in our memories that have impact. When I was in junior high school, my father had a really good friendship with the president of TSU. Dr. Davis was a wonderful man and at that time, we were in a totally segregated environment. I’m so sad that I was raised in a segregated environment. I think that’s a real missed opportunity for growth.

Dr. Davis called my father and asked if he would be willing to come here to campus and have a cup of coffee since we can’t meet anywhere because everything’s segregated. He had an idea he wanted to share. TSU had this amazing basketball team but they couldn’t play any other teams that weren’t black. So they couldn’t get any national recognition for this incredible basketball team because of segregation.

Dr. Davis told my father he had found a Methodist school in Kentucky, Georgetown, all white, that was willing to play their team. The only way he thought it could happen would be if her father would referee the game and find a black referee to be the second referee for the game.

Sandra’s father said he needed to talk with his family first because it could impact all of them. So when he came home that night and told us what happened, Mother and I told him, “Do it; we have to do it.”

My father said, “You know, this could impact your life in a negative way, at least in the beginning.”

We said, “That’s fine.” So we went to the game and we were one of only about five or ten white faces in that crowd. TSU had incredible basketball players. They could have probably beaten just about anybody in the country – they were so good.

I did have people in my school who called me names-not my close friends- but there were many people who thought that was a terrible thing to do. My father’s tires were slashed. We suffered some minimal consequence for that but I always felt that it was worth it.

This was one of those watershed moments when I didn’t mind sticking my neck out for other things that are worth it. That was a good life lesson when you’re in junior high school. At our church there were some dark-skinned missionaries who wore turbans and from where I’m not sure. But some of the pillars of the church walked out because their skin was dark. I remember going home and saying I didn’t want to go to that church anymore. I had that other experience with TSU and I said, “This is just wrong.” I’m not sure if I would have felt the missionary experience was wrong if I had not had the other experience. At the time I didn’t realize what a big moment it was.

TCU asked my father if he would set up a schedule of playing with top ranked teams. In the northeast, they already had integrated basketball. My father had refereed all over the country and knew all the coaches, so he made these calls and was able to line up a schedule for the next year. It was really cutting edge to be doing that. That was years before Perry Wallace played at Vanderbilt.

Interestingly when my father died at 95, I had several letters from the young men who were in my class who were athletes my father took to those games, who told me what that experience meant to them. They were in their 60’s or 70’s and that was a watershed moment for them. That was a big moment for me and I’ve held those beliefs from that day forward.

I remember where I was standing when I heard that JFK had been assassinated. I remember where I was standing during 9/11. I remember where I was standing when Martin Luther King was killed. I think those are times when everyone reflects on what does it mean to be here. What can I do that would make a difference.

I think there was so much embracing of Kennedy when he was President, I thought a lot of people who really wanted to be a part of public service became a part of public service because of him. I hope there are other benchmarks that give people that impetus to be a part of public service.

About half of my career has been private sector and the other half public sector. I think I worked equally hard at both but there was something bigger about public service than being in a corporate environment where you were working for stockholders and for yourself. There’s a totally different mentality about being in public service. I remember so well when I first went into public service, walking into a restaurant and thinking ‘the people in this restaurant pay my salary; I better do a good job.’ There was a feeling of I owe these people.

I hope people understand what public service is and not that all people who work for the government are lazy. I never worked harder and was around people who worked hard. I’d like for people to be willing to open their hearts and minds to doing something in public service. It enhances your ability to be empathetic.

What obst
acles and disappointments have you faced that you were able to put into perspective, turn into a positive, and/or contribute to in a way that made things better?

When I worked for the bank, we had this incredible experience of starting out with 22 people which had grown and grown. Then it was purchased by the Butcher Brothers. We were all very wary of them and for good reason. The president of the bank was intertwined with them which also made us a little wary. I was with that bank for 10 years and it had four names and three owners. I was in the same desk, same place for that entire time, and I was in charge of each name change. Then, all of a sudden, the bank became insolvent because of underhanded deals the Butcher Brothers had done. I was humiliated and angry about it because I didn’t know what was going on. I was the spokesperson for the bank to the media and I later learned that the president of the bank had told everybody not to tell me what was going on, so I could honestly say, “I don’t know,” to the press. I felt betrayed yet I felt the president was protecting me because he knew I wouldn’t be very good at not telling the truth. The press was just all over this and I was getting calls from New York, Chicago and people who were pretty belligerent in wanting answers.

Then union planners headquartered in Memphis bought the bank. They offered me a job but I would have to move to Memphis and I was so upset over all of it that I need to think about what I wanted to do next.

I didn’t do anything for a couple of months and neither did the people at the bank. We were all shattered by the whole thing and not knowing what we faced. The whole thing had hurt my confidence and ego and I hoped I could bounce back from it. However, I made lifelong friends and learned that knowing who the people are above you is critical. It’s easy these days to check people out.

My suggestion is to think long and hard about what you are passionate about and try to shape what you do around that. I think it’s a very difficult to do unless you’ve grown up wanting to be a doctor, lawyer, nurse or whatever. Try some things on though, thinking you might like it but end up not really liking it. Feel confident that if you keep your mind and heart open, you will hook into something that will make you go ‘WOW, I really like this,’ and not get discouraged. Know that this, too, shall pass and it’s going to get better. Each day that you do something to make it better will make it faster at getting better. Taking a step in the right direction each day is what it is.

Writing skills are essential and I would not have been able to do any of my jobs without them.